Please note that the text of this page was last updated on 14 October 1996; the contents of this page is being preserved as-is for posterity. The only changes made since that time were (a) to update the page markup to current XHTML standards, and (b) to obscure email addresses located throughout these pages (except for USENET postings). Needless to say, many of the links to external sites are no longer functional after 13+ years.

Path: visi.com!coffee
From: coffee@visi.com (John Birrenbach)
Newsgroups: winternet.general
Subject: Mr Mike sends a response Two weeks later
Date: Tue, 06 Aug 1996 08:18:37 -0500
Organization: (missing)
Lines: 9
Message-ID: 
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192-46.dynamic.visi.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.2.0b12

Oh Mr Mike F the owner of Winternet has finally responded to the
multiple e-mail I sent.

Here they are along with my standard response.

Thanks
JOHN
a former winternet customer
now a satisfied VISI Customer

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Path: visi.com!coffee
From: coffee@visi.com (John Birrenbach)
Newsgroups: winternet.general
Subject: Re: Mr Mike sends a response Two weeks later
Date: Tue, 06 Aug 1996 08:20:34 -0500
Organization: (missing)
Lines: 75
Message-ID: 
References: 
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192-46.dynamic.visi.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.2.0b12


From: Michael Frankowski 
Posted-Date: Mon, 5 Aug 1996 14:48:52 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: Stupid Ass Message from Winternet
To: excoffee@winternet.com (John Birrenbach)
Date: Mon, 5 Aug 1996 14:48:51 -0500 (CDT)

Good Afternoon,

>  I hope that by this time you have a lot more information about what
>is going on. We are trying to keep you informed about what we are
>seeing here in the office.
> 
> INFORMED ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR MIND!!!!!!!!!


  I had hopes that the stuff we are posting to the news groups might
be giving you some more information about what it happening.  I would
also note that there are a lot of people posting one thing or another
about us so there is a lot of information on the news groups to be
had.

> Toms message was the only message I ever recieved despite several calls and
> e-mails and his message said nothing about what the problem was or when it
> might be fixed.  I am about fed up with winternet and its so called service.

  Is the problem still persisting??  And would you like a more
technical explanation about what the problem is/was?? Let me see if I
can give you the answers to the questions you would ask of us.

[My stuff removed.]

> No Michael My day is not going well.  If I don't get an answer about
> the censoring and deleting of people files I am gone and so are the
> two other accounts I manage and brought to winternet.

  You sound very unhappy with the service. It sounds like we are not
providing the service you would like.  You can reach Vector at
288-0880, Millennium Communications at 338-5509. MinnNet Comminucations
at 944-8660, and Sky Point Communications at 475-2459

  Do the right thing for your customers, if you feel we aren't the
right provider find them another one.

  If you would like to cancel please write cancel across your bill and
mail it back. Or fax in a request to our fax number at (612)
333-1507. We are NOT accepting E-Mail cancellations.

  As for censorship of E-Mail, there is NONE! here.  There have been
E-Mail loses, as reported, and there have been problems delivering
E-Mail, or getting our mail server to accept customers incoming E-Mail
to send out to the net, as reported. We DO NOT censor any E-Mail here,
that is your private property. I cannot state that in the strongest
term.

  As for the removal of people's files.  That is not going on. I do
not get on-line and pick out peoples files are remove them. Having
said that I also have to say that I might have to remove peoples
files. If someone uploads a copyrighted work, say Lotus 1-2-3, onto
the system that is breaking the laws of the United States, and in that
case we would remove the file. We do have to uphold the laws of the
state we operate in. I would also note at this time that there is a
5Mb quota on the system and if we E-Mail out a request to a user to
bring themselves under quota and they don't respond after reading the
E-Mail then the system will do the work for us. (Even if we don't send
out the E-Mail actually.) This hasn't changed.

> John Birrenbach
> 
>         Executive Coffee & Tea
>  444 Cedar St,  St. Paul, MN  55101
>        JAVA for Your JAVA
>  http://www.winternet.com/~excoffee

  - Michael (mfrankow@winternet.com)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Path: visi.com!coffee
From: coffee@visi.com (John Birrenbach)
Newsgroups: winternet.general
Subject: Re: Mr Mike sends a response Two weeks later
Date: Tue, 06 Aug 1996 08:21:01 -0500
Organization: (missing)
Lines: 72
Message-ID: 
References: 
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192-46.dynamic.visi.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.2.0b12

From: Michael Frankowski 
Posted-Date: Mon, 5 Aug 1996 14:58:22 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: Is Winternet Insane or what is the deal with these guys
To: excoffee@winternet.com (John Birrenbach)
Date: Mon, 5 Aug 1996 14:58:22 -0500 (CDT)

Good Afternoon

> I just got the following message from I guess one of the owners or 
> somebody who works for winternet I guess since they never seem to
> identify themselves in any way or manner they just seem to speak for
> winternet.

  That would be me, and since I am Michael Frankowski -- The skinny
one who doesn't know anything about running a system....if you are
following the news groups, I would be an Owner. And I am afraid that I
have too speak for winternet, I certainly cannot speak for myself.

> Since winternet has never officially let us all know who
> is in charge, they may have posted it to the newsgoups but with the
> apparent censorship I don't think I have seen it and it never appeared
> in my mail box, although again due to the problems they seem to be having
> it may have been sent and just never arrived.  Anyway if you can figure
> this message out then you are a better person than I am gungadin.

  I will give it my best try.

> Thanks for your intense digestion of this material.
> John Birrenbach

[My header removed]

> Good Morning,
> 
[Old message removed.]

>   I hope that by this time you have a lot more information about what
> is going on. We are trying to keep you informed about what we are
> seeing here in the office.

  Since we are posting to the news groups, sent out one mass E-Mail
message, put the information up on the web page, and there is a small
group of people, including Mike Horwath who is proving plenty of
information on the news groups I had hopes that you would have gotten
some information from some source about what is happening, and what is
happening with the hardware.

>   My belief is that Thomas sent you this reply to let you know that
> someone in the office had received your E-Mail and was acting upon it.

  I can only tell you what I believe. I think it is nice to get an
E-Mailed response saying we got the message even if we don't have an
answer yet. We are alive on this end, and we do read it all.

>   Thank you for giving us a little time to try and improve the
> situation, if you are still having problems please send me E-Mail and
> I will work on getting them cleaned up in a timely manor.
> 
>   Hope your day goes well,
> 
>   - Michael (mfrankow@winternet.com)

  The above is a polite closing paragraph, I thought. I still think it
is a nice closing paragraph. Why shouldn't I thank you for a service
you are providing us be being giving us some time to try and make the
service better for all??

  - Michael (mfrankow@winternet.com)

P.S>My position here is as an Owner, the Voice of StarNet
Communications, President, and C.E.O. - Head od day to day operations
of StarNet Communications.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Path: visi.com!coffee
From: coffee@visi.com (John Birrenbach)
Newsgroups: winternet.general
Subject: Re: Mr Mike sends a response Two weeks later
Date: Tue, 06 Aug 1996 08:21:39 -0500
Organization: (missing)
Lines: 33
Message-ID: 
References: 
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192-46.dynamic.visi.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.2.0b12

From: Michael Frankowski 
Posted-Date: Mon, 5 Aug 1996 18:46:48 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: Really Great Customer Service Today
To: excoffee@winternet.com (John Birrenbach)
Date: Mon, 5 Aug 1996 18:46:47 -0500 (CDT)

Good Evening,

> I just wanted to tell you since you seem to be someone who is in charge at
> winternet.

> Since you failed to respond to my message about the censorship and
> deletion of peoples files from their area's I decided to call the
> office.  (Please see enclosure for a more detailed description of my
> call).

[Stuff about scott and your state of dissatisfaction with Winternet removed]

> I posted the enclosure to the newsgroups.
> 
> Sincerely
> John Birrenbach

  Thank you for sending me a copy of your comments on the news group.
It is good to know that you stand by them enough and aren't afraid of
them that you are willing to E-Mail them to me as well as posting
them. Unlike some others who are only willing to post in the news groups
yet unwilling to E-Mail.


[Message removed]

  - Michael (mfrankow@winternet.com)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Path: visi.com!coffee
From: coffee@visi.com (John Birrenbach)
Newsgroups: winternet.general
Subject: Re: Mr Mike sends a response Two weeks later
Date: Tue, 06 Aug 1996 08:22:02 -0500
Organization: (missing)
Lines: 26
Message-ID: 
References: 
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192-46.dynamic.visi.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.2.0b12

From: Michael Frankowski 
Posted-Date: Mon, 5 Aug 1996 20:09:01 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: Wump
To: excoffee@winternet.com (John Birrenbach)
Date: Mon, 5 Aug 1996 20:09:01 -0500 (CDT)

Good Evening,

> Why is it that NO ONE IN THE OFFICE NEW ABOUT IT WHEN I CALLED ON FRIDAY
> July 20th????????

  Probably because the decision wasn't made until the last minuet. My
fault more than anything else.

> Can you explain why the office Manager has no E-Mail address?

  Because he manages the office and doesn't really need one. He will
have one soon.  But why do you assume that being an office manager
requires that he get E-Mail?

>         ----  I am having a real tough time understanding why someone 
>         ----  would not be proud to announce who they work for.

  Thank you for your letters, they always provide inspiration to me,

  - Michael (mfrankow@winternet.com)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Path: visi.com!coffee
From: coffee@visi.com (John Birrenbach)
Newsgroups: winternet.general
Subject: Re: Mr Mike sends a response Two weeks later
Date: Tue, 06 Aug 1996 08:22:28 -0500
Organization: (missing)
Lines: 26
Message-ID: 
References: 
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192-46.dynamic.visi.com
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Newsreader: Yet Another NewsWatcher 2.2.0b12

From: Michael Frankowski 
Posted-Date: Mon, 5 Aug 1996 20:11:24 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: Planned Downtime
To: excoffee@winternet.com (John Birrenbach)
Date: Mon, 5 Aug 1996 20:11:24 -0500 (CDT)

Good Evening,

  Don't you HATE not having good follow-up lines.

[Removed Thomases post.]

> You know TomKat it would be nice if you would learn how to use the MASS
> MAILING and send this to us in the mail like the old admins would do.
> 
> Not everyone reads the winternet groups and even fewer read the .announce
> since for the past few weeks nothing of interest has been posted here.

  And even more people called too say "I do not want too see another
letter about anything like this in my E-Mail box. I have had enough.
If you do this I will cancel my account on the spot."

  But since you express an interest in being kept up on this I will add
you to a list of people who get a bounce of the annouce group.

  - Michael (mfrankow@winternet.com)